JB-  I'm sure you knew we were going to talk about American Idol.

Jim-  Of course.

JB-  You two pretty much go hand in hand.  Tell me about that experience.  When you auditioned with all those other people, did you ever think you would make it to the top 10?

Jim-  No.  No, I didn't even want a record deal.  The whole experience was kind of a fluke.  I was going to school and majoring in musical theatre, I was just trying to take classes and, you know, do what you do after high school.  And with Idol it was the first season and we were total guinea pigs so it was very experimental.  You know, half the time the producers didn't know what...they were doing.  I was just in the right place at the right time, and that's all I can say.  I had a great time and everyone was cool.  There are a lot of things that happened behind the scenes that, you know, people don't see and would be shocked to find out that they happen.  But, that's a reality show, I mean, they're looking for ratings. 

JB-  What kind of stuff are you talking about?

Jim- Just like throwing in rules, taking out rules and, you know, cutting you and putting you back in because they feel like it… putting you back in the show the next day.  It's just stupid.  They were totally unprepared, like just adding rules.  But that (messes) with your emotions.  The further I got in the competition the more that I wanted it.  The whole thing was a tease because you kept making it further and then all of a sudden I was top 10 and then my life changed and it was a taste of this notoriety.  And then you're eliminated and then you tour, you do a 30 city tour with everyone, and then that's taken away and you have to get back to that point on your own.  That's hard.  Like what if it's that you just want to work and make money?  And everyone else is like, "Well, you know, Jim is probably flipping burgers or he's probably working in a shoe store."  Well, I'm like, "No, you don't even know what kind of pressure we have to put up with."  Because people are sitting around twiddling their thumbs wondering how far we're going to go after the competition.  So it's tough, it's really hard.  But it's all about: do you want it bad enough?  If so, what kind of sacrifices are you willing to make?  That's just sort of the way to do it.

JB-  So what sort of sacrifices did you make?

Jim-  I moved out to L.A. after the tour.  I took the amount of money that I made on tour with me to get an apartment.  I moved in with a friend of mine who made it into the top 30.  We both agreed that after the show we would move out to L.A. together.  I lived there for two years.  I worked in a tanning salon for like two months after the show.  People would come into the tanning salon and ask me, "Hey, weren't you that kid?" or "Whoa, you're that dude." And I'm like, "Yeah, let me wipe the sweat off this bed and I'll be right back."

JB-  That's got to be strange, going from being on the top show in the country and then all of a sudden you're working just an everyday job.  Is that where most of those people are now?  Do you stay in contact with a lot of them?

Jim-  I don't know what a lot of people are doing.  I know (first runner-up to Kelly Clarkson) Justin Guarini is working on a jazz record and he's trying to get a label.  And Kelly, well, you know…

JB-  We know where she's at.

Jim-  Right, right… which is awesome because she's a good person and she deserves it.

JB-  Do you still have contact with her?

Jim-  It's weird because I'll go a long time without talking to her and then someone will say, "Hey, she's shooting her music video right outside my work."  And I'll say, "Tell her I'm thinking about her.  Tell her I love her a lot and that I'm proud of her" or whatever.  And then it's, "She's got your album on her iPod and she digs it," and I'm like "Cool!"  We exchange messages through other people.

JB-  During the whole process, during the whole show, were you kind of in the back of your mind thinking, "What's my plan of attack here?  What road do I take to get what I want?"

Jim-  Yeah totally.  It was near the end of the tour that our (record company) RCA rep came up to us and was like, "Jim, you, um, need to make a decision." And I was like, "About what?" "Well, people are starting to find out that you're gay and you need to make a decision to 'come out' or not because Out Magazine just named you one of 2002's most intriguing people." So I thought about it for all of maybe 10 minutes and I was, "OK, let's do it.  Let's just go with it." And I did that because I thought to myself, "Let's weigh the pros and cons.  If I "come out" is my career going to be affected?"  Well I really can't answer that because I don't really know.  So that's kind of a moot point.  But I thought, "If I lose fans for "coming out" then I never wanted those people to be my fans in the first place." And then there was one major point I really wanted to think about and that was, "Will a member of my family or I be hurt, like physically?" You know, am I going to be somewhere and just get the shit beat out of me?  I live in like "Pleasantville", Illinois, it's not the most liberal community.  I came out to our local paper and it was known as "the faggot issue".  I mean, that's just how it is.  So I talked about it, I talked to my parents… I was like, "Mom, I'm going to "come out" publicly and I want you to have my back on that."  And she said, "OK, just be careful and we support you and we love you."  They just knew that it was going to do more good than harm.  And it did.  It was this big four-page spread in The Advocate (magazine) in January of '03.  So far it's been OK.  Am I thinking in the back of my mind, "Am I not getting more opportunities because I'm gay?"  Sure, yeah, it's crossed my mind.  But I have to keep focused and I have to reread some fan mail and think, "OK I made the right decision."  It's not easy.  Everyone thinks you're this big…celebrity and I'm not.  I'm just wanting it really, really bad.  I'm not compromising myself.  At the end of the day, when this is all over, when I stop doing this or if I stop doing it, I want to look back and say, "Yeah, I did that the best that I could" and people view me for me.  I know that sounds so Hallmark and cliché, but all we have is dignity and self respect so do it right.  You get one shot.